At 11:00am today (local time in Rome), in the Paul VI Hall, the Holy Father, Pope Francis received in audience a group of people participating in the 40th International Congress of Pueri Canotres - an international gathering of child choristers taking place in Rome from December 28, 2015 to January 1, 2016.
First question
What do you think of our singing? Do you like to sing?
Pope Francis
What do you think of our singing? Do you like to sing? .. I would love to hear you sing some more! I only heard one song, I hope that you will sing others ... I like to hear singing, but if I were to sing, I would make a fool of myself because I don't know how to sing. Yet I can speak well, even though I have a speech defect, in phonetics ... but I love to hear singing. Let me tell you a story. Since I was a baby - we are five brothers in my family - since we were children, our mother, on Saturdays, at 2:00pm, made us sit down in front of the radio to listen. What were we listening to? Every Saturday, there was a programme of operatic music, and our mother would teach us about opera, explaining: Listen to how they do that ... Since I was a child, I have had the pleasure of listening to people sing, but I have never been able to sing. However, one of my grandparents, who was a carpenter, would always sing while he worked, always. The pleasure of hearing people sing has been part of my life from childhood. Music and singing make me so happy. What do I think about your singing? I hope to be able to hear some more. Ok? Is that possible?
I will tell you one thing: singing teaches the soul, singing does the soul good. For example, when a mother wants to put her child to sleep, she doesn't say: One, two, three, four ... She sings a lullaby, sings; it's good for the soul; the child becomes quiet and goes to sleep. Saint Augustine used a very beautiful phrase. Every one of you should learn it in your own language. While speaking about Christian life, about the joy of Christian life, he says: Sing and walk. The Christian life is a journey, but it is not a sad journey, it is a joyful journey. For this reason, you should sing. Sing and walk, don't forget! Everyone can say it in your own language: sing and walk! (the children repeat: Sing and walk!) I can't hear you ... (Sing and walk!) There. Remember this well: sing and walk. Your soul will rejoice in the joy of the gospel.
Second question
How do you manage to always be so good? Do you ever get angry? What is your advice for the new year?
Pope Francis
Once there was a young man who came close to Jesus and said something very similar to what you just said: Jesus, good master. And Jesus looked at him and said: No, only God is good. Only God is good, Jesus said. And we? Are we wicked? No, half and half, we have a little bit of everything within us ... We always have within us the woundedness of original sin which tempts us not to always be good ... but always remember: only God is good, and if you want to find goodness, go to the Lord, He is all goodness, all love, all mercy, and do you know what I do to be a little good? I stay close to the Lord, and I ask the Lord: Lord, help me not to be a sinner, help me not to be very demanding, help me not to be too hard on anyone, help me not to be jealous, envious or to get roped into other things ... and there are so many other things ... All those things. Ask for the grace to be good, because only God is good. Even this we should learn. Can we say it all together? Everyone in his own language: Only God is good. (the children repeat: only God is good. One more time. (Only God is good). Remember the advice from Saint Augustine that we repeated together. What was it? (the children respond: Sing and walk!) Only God is good. Remember this well.
But there are some good people, yes, who are close to the Lord, saints! So many hidden saints in daily life, in our lives, many people who suffer and offer their sufferings for the conversion of sinners. Many, many people who are so close to the goodness of God, they are saints. But, who is the only one who is all good? (the children respond: God). Only God is good.
The other question: Do you ever get angry? Yes, I get angry but I don't bite! Sometimes I get angry, when someone does something that is not good, I get a bit angry ... but it helps me to stop and to think about the times when I have made others angry. I think and I ask myself: Have I ever made someone else angry? Ah yes, many times. So, you don't have a right to be angry. But this one has done ... Yes, but if he has done that thing that is bad, that is not good, call him and speak to him as a brother, speak like brothers and sisters, speak, speak. But without any anger, because anger is poisonous, it poisons the soul. Many times I have seen children and young people who are frightened. Why? Because their parents, or at school, they are scolded. And when someone is angry and scolds, it hurts, it really hurts: scolding someone is like stabbing at the soul, it is not good. Have you understood this?
I get angry, yes, sometimes I get angry, but it helps me to think about the times when I made other people angry, this helps me to calm down a bit, it makes me a bit more quiet. Getting angry is one thing that hurts not only the other person, it also hurts us, poisons us. There are people, who I am certain that you know, who have sour souls, who are always bitter, who live with anger. It seems that every morning, they brush their teeth with acid in order to be so angry! People who are like that ...: it's a sickness. Of course, if there is something I don't like, I get a bit angry. But this, the habit of getting angry, the habit of shouting, the habit of scolding others, this is poison! I ask you, and everyone in his or her language, respond: how can you describe Jesus' soul, sweet or bitter? (they respond: Sweet!). Why was it sweet? Because when he got angry, his anger never affected his soul, it was only to correct someone, and then peace would return to him.
What is your advice for the new year? I did one good thing in these days, when I took some time to make a spiritual retreat: to pray awhile. Because I realized that bishops and priests - I am a bishop - should lead the people of God first of all with prayer: it is the first service that we can give them. I will tell you a story. At the beginning of Christianity there was so much work because many people were converting and the apostles didn't have time. Some of them came to complain because they were not taking good care of widows and orphans. It was true, but there was no time to do everything. They held a council among themselves and they decided to entrust some men solely to the service of the people. This was the time when deacons were created. Deacons were born this way. You can see this in the Book of the Acts of the Apostles. And what did Peter say, Saint Peter, the first Pope? What did he say? They will do this, and we, the apostles, only two things: prayer and the proclamation of the gospel, preaching. Therefore, for a bishop, the first task is prayer, the first task: you can't be a bishop in the Church without having prayer as your first priority. Then comes the proclamation of the gospel. In these days, in response to your question, I thought that a good resolution for the new year would be to pray a bit more. Ok? I also ask you: do you think that this would be a good thing also for you to do? (they respond: Yes). Pray a bit more, because the Church goes forward with the prayer of the saints. Pray for the Church!
Third question
When you were young, what did you dream of becoming? In the evenings, when I watch television with my family, I see many sad and dramatic stories: will the world always be like this, even when I grow up?
Pope Francis
If I told you the truth about your first question, I would make you laugh ... I will tell you the truth. The question was: When you were young, what did you dream of becoming? When I was a child, I would often go with my grandmother, but also with my mother, to the market to shop. At that time, there were no supermarkets, there was no television, there was nothing of the sort ... The market was on the street and there were places for greens, for fruit, for meat, for fish and people could buy everything. One day at home, at table, I was asked: what would you like to do when you grow up? Do you know what I said? A butcher. Why? Because there were butchers in the market - there were 3 or 4 places where we could buy meat - they would take the knife, cut pieces ... it's an art, and I liked to watch them, to look at them. Now, I changed my mind, obviously; but, in response to your question, when I was small, I thought about becoming a butcher. I would have been happy.
Then, the second question - this is serious! - At night, while I am at dinner with my family, watching television, I always hear sad and dramatic news ... but the world, when I grow up, will it always be like this? What you say is true. There are so many people who are suffering in the world today. There are wars. How many wars are there? In Africa, think about how many wars there are. The Middle East, where Jesus was born, is at war. Ukraine, war. In many places. In Latin America, there is war. These are terrible things! What does war accomplish? It causes poverty, suffering, evil. Always only sad things ... Think about the children. You, young boys and girls, children, have the gift of God to be able to sing, to be happy, to live the Christian life as Saint Augustine said - what did Saint Augustine say? (they respond: Sing and walk!) -, but there are children in our world who don't have food; there are children who can't go to school, because there is war, poverty, and there are no schools; there are children who, when they are sick, can't go to the hospital. Pray for these children. Pray! Will the world always be like this? The world can get better, but there is something that we don't like to talk about, but which we must talk about: in the world, there is a struggle between good and evil - philosophers say - the struggle between the devil and God. This still exists. When anyone of us is tempted to something bad, this little bad thing is inspired by the devil, who, through the weakness that is left within us as a result of original sin, inspires such thoughts within us. Evil exists in small things as well as in bigger things; in wars like - for example - a young boy or a young girl who tells a lie: this is a war against the truth of God, against the truth of life, against joy. This struggle between the devil and God, the bible tells us that it will go on until the end. This is clear, no? Have you understood this? It's clear. We all have within us a field of battle. We fight between good and evil, all of us. We have graces and temptations, and we must speak with our parish priests, our catechists about these things in order to know them well. This is the first thing. The second: there are many good things in the world, and I ask myself: why are these good things never published? Because it seems that people only like to see bad things or to hear terrible news. Let us think about Africa: many bad things, many wars - as I said - but there are missionaries, priests, sisters who have spent their entire lives there, preaching the gospel, in poverty ... Last month when I went to Africa, I found nuns ... I remember one who was 83 years old, she was Italian, and she told me: I have been here since I was 26 years old. And there are so many holy families, many parents who teach their children well. Why do we never see families on television who teach well, who teach their children well? We don't ever see such things! Because we have an attraction for evil: it seems that we get more enjoyment from watching evil things than good things, great and beautiful things. The devil does his part - that's true - but also God is at work: there are many holy people! Not only in the missions, but throughout the world, in our workplaces, in families; many parents, many grandmothers and grandfathers who help those who are sick, who have problems; and this is never seen on television. Why? Because these things don't rate, they don't make good publicity ... Here in Italy, I have discovered many associations, men and women who give of their time to help, to accompany, to care for the sick. This is good. But this is never seen in advertisements. Is this true or not? If you want ratings - either in newspapers, or on television, or whatever - only tell about terrible things; people get bored with good things. Or else, perhaps they don't know how to present things well, to tell stories about good things well.
When you (speaking to the child who had asked the question) watch television, at home, remember these two things: there is a struggle in the world between good and evil, many children are suffering, there are wars, there are terrible things, because the struggle is between God and the devil; but also think about the many people, many holy people, many people who give their lives to help others, to pray for others. Why is it that we never see cloistered monks on television who spend their lives praying for everyone? This doesn't interest anyone ... Maybe they are more interested in the jewelry from an important firm, who wants to be seen ... things that lead to vanity. Let us not be fooled! In the world, there are terrible things, terrible, terrible, and this is the work of the devil against God; but there are holy things, holy things, great things which are the work of God. There are hidden saints. Don't forget this word: hidden saints, those who we don't see. Ok?
I want to thank you for all of this, but I want to hear another song before I tell you if I like how you sing or not ... And another thing: I want to hear you tell me again what Saint Augustine said about the Christian life. How should we live our lives? (they respond: Sing and walk!). Sing and walk! Second: who is good? (Only God is good)
Good. Now, I'm waiting for a beautiful song ... Thank you!
(the children sing a song)
Pope Francis
Now I can reply: you sing very well! Thank you!
I will give you my blessing, and also my greetings for the new year. And tomorrow, we will see each other in the Basilica, it will be a pleasure.
Let us pray to Our Lady, everyone in your own language.
Hail Mary ....
(Blessing)
Transcription of the dialogue between His Holiness, Pope Francis
and the choristers in attendance for the Pueri Cantores Congress
First question
What do you think of our singing? Do you like to sing?
Pope Francis
What do you think of our singing? Do you like to sing? .. I would love to hear you sing some more! I only heard one song, I hope that you will sing others ... I like to hear singing, but if I were to sing, I would make a fool of myself because I don't know how to sing. Yet I can speak well, even though I have a speech defect, in phonetics ... but I love to hear singing. Let me tell you a story. Since I was a baby - we are five brothers in my family - since we were children, our mother, on Saturdays, at 2:00pm, made us sit down in front of the radio to listen. What were we listening to? Every Saturday, there was a programme of operatic music, and our mother would teach us about opera, explaining: Listen to how they do that ... Since I was a child, I have had the pleasure of listening to people sing, but I have never been able to sing. However, one of my grandparents, who was a carpenter, would always sing while he worked, always. The pleasure of hearing people sing has been part of my life from childhood. Music and singing make me so happy. What do I think about your singing? I hope to be able to hear some more. Ok? Is that possible?
I will tell you one thing: singing teaches the soul, singing does the soul good. For example, when a mother wants to put her child to sleep, she doesn't say: One, two, three, four ... She sings a lullaby, sings; it's good for the soul; the child becomes quiet and goes to sleep. Saint Augustine used a very beautiful phrase. Every one of you should learn it in your own language. While speaking about Christian life, about the joy of Christian life, he says: Sing and walk. The Christian life is a journey, but it is not a sad journey, it is a joyful journey. For this reason, you should sing. Sing and walk, don't forget! Everyone can say it in your own language: sing and walk! (the children repeat: Sing and walk!) I can't hear you ... (Sing and walk!) There. Remember this well: sing and walk. Your soul will rejoice in the joy of the gospel.
Second question
How do you manage to always be so good? Do you ever get angry? What is your advice for the new year?
Pope Francis
Once there was a young man who came close to Jesus and said something very similar to what you just said: Jesus, good master. And Jesus looked at him and said: No, only God is good. Only God is good, Jesus said. And we? Are we wicked? No, half and half, we have a little bit of everything within us ... We always have within us the woundedness of original sin which tempts us not to always be good ... but always remember: only God is good, and if you want to find goodness, go to the Lord, He is all goodness, all love, all mercy, and do you know what I do to be a little good? I stay close to the Lord, and I ask the Lord: Lord, help me not to be a sinner, help me not to be very demanding, help me not to be too hard on anyone, help me not to be jealous, envious or to get roped into other things ... and there are so many other things ... All those things. Ask for the grace to be good, because only God is good. Even this we should learn. Can we say it all together? Everyone in his own language: Only God is good. (the children repeat: only God is good. One more time. (Only God is good). Remember the advice from Saint Augustine that we repeated together. What was it? (the children respond: Sing and walk!) Only God is good. Remember this well.
But there are some good people, yes, who are close to the Lord, saints! So many hidden saints in daily life, in our lives, many people who suffer and offer their sufferings for the conversion of sinners. Many, many people who are so close to the goodness of God, they are saints. But, who is the only one who is all good? (the children respond: God). Only God is good.
The other question: Do you ever get angry? Yes, I get angry but I don't bite! Sometimes I get angry, when someone does something that is not good, I get a bit angry ... but it helps me to stop and to think about the times when I have made others angry. I think and I ask myself: Have I ever made someone else angry? Ah yes, many times. So, you don't have a right to be angry. But this one has done ... Yes, but if he has done that thing that is bad, that is not good, call him and speak to him as a brother, speak like brothers and sisters, speak, speak. But without any anger, because anger is poisonous, it poisons the soul. Many times I have seen children and young people who are frightened. Why? Because their parents, or at school, they are scolded. And when someone is angry and scolds, it hurts, it really hurts: scolding someone is like stabbing at the soul, it is not good. Have you understood this?
I get angry, yes, sometimes I get angry, but it helps me to think about the times when I made other people angry, this helps me to calm down a bit, it makes me a bit more quiet. Getting angry is one thing that hurts not only the other person, it also hurts us, poisons us. There are people, who I am certain that you know, who have sour souls, who are always bitter, who live with anger. It seems that every morning, they brush their teeth with acid in order to be so angry! People who are like that ...: it's a sickness. Of course, if there is something I don't like, I get a bit angry. But this, the habit of getting angry, the habit of shouting, the habit of scolding others, this is poison! I ask you, and everyone in his or her language, respond: how can you describe Jesus' soul, sweet or bitter? (they respond: Sweet!). Why was it sweet? Because when he got angry, his anger never affected his soul, it was only to correct someone, and then peace would return to him.
What is your advice for the new year? I did one good thing in these days, when I took some time to make a spiritual retreat: to pray awhile. Because I realized that bishops and priests - I am a bishop - should lead the people of God first of all with prayer: it is the first service that we can give them. I will tell you a story. At the beginning of Christianity there was so much work because many people were converting and the apostles didn't have time. Some of them came to complain because they were not taking good care of widows and orphans. It was true, but there was no time to do everything. They held a council among themselves and they decided to entrust some men solely to the service of the people. This was the time when deacons were created. Deacons were born this way. You can see this in the Book of the Acts of the Apostles. And what did Peter say, Saint Peter, the first Pope? What did he say? They will do this, and we, the apostles, only two things: prayer and the proclamation of the gospel, preaching. Therefore, for a bishop, the first task is prayer, the first task: you can't be a bishop in the Church without having prayer as your first priority. Then comes the proclamation of the gospel. In these days, in response to your question, I thought that a good resolution for the new year would be to pray a bit more. Ok? I also ask you: do you think that this would be a good thing also for you to do? (they respond: Yes). Pray a bit more, because the Church goes forward with the prayer of the saints. Pray for the Church!
Third question
When you were young, what did you dream of becoming? In the evenings, when I watch television with my family, I see many sad and dramatic stories: will the world always be like this, even when I grow up?
Pope Francis
If I told you the truth about your first question, I would make you laugh ... I will tell you the truth. The question was: When you were young, what did you dream of becoming? When I was a child, I would often go with my grandmother, but also with my mother, to the market to shop. At that time, there were no supermarkets, there was no television, there was nothing of the sort ... The market was on the street and there were places for greens, for fruit, for meat, for fish and people could buy everything. One day at home, at table, I was asked: what would you like to do when you grow up? Do you know what I said? A butcher. Why? Because there were butchers in the market - there were 3 or 4 places where we could buy meat - they would take the knife, cut pieces ... it's an art, and I liked to watch them, to look at them. Now, I changed my mind, obviously; but, in response to your question, when I was small, I thought about becoming a butcher. I would have been happy.
Then, the second question - this is serious! - At night, while I am at dinner with my family, watching television, I always hear sad and dramatic news ... but the world, when I grow up, will it always be like this? What you say is true. There are so many people who are suffering in the world today. There are wars. How many wars are there? In Africa, think about how many wars there are. The Middle East, where Jesus was born, is at war. Ukraine, war. In many places. In Latin America, there is war. These are terrible things! What does war accomplish? It causes poverty, suffering, evil. Always only sad things ... Think about the children. You, young boys and girls, children, have the gift of God to be able to sing, to be happy, to live the Christian life as Saint Augustine said - what did Saint Augustine say? (they respond: Sing and walk!) -, but there are children in our world who don't have food; there are children who can't go to school, because there is war, poverty, and there are no schools; there are children who, when they are sick, can't go to the hospital. Pray for these children. Pray! Will the world always be like this? The world can get better, but there is something that we don't like to talk about, but which we must talk about: in the world, there is a struggle between good and evil - philosophers say - the struggle between the devil and God. This still exists. When anyone of us is tempted to something bad, this little bad thing is inspired by the devil, who, through the weakness that is left within us as a result of original sin, inspires such thoughts within us. Evil exists in small things as well as in bigger things; in wars like - for example - a young boy or a young girl who tells a lie: this is a war against the truth of God, against the truth of life, against joy. This struggle between the devil and God, the bible tells us that it will go on until the end. This is clear, no? Have you understood this? It's clear. We all have within us a field of battle. We fight between good and evil, all of us. We have graces and temptations, and we must speak with our parish priests, our catechists about these things in order to know them well. This is the first thing. The second: there are many good things in the world, and I ask myself: why are these good things never published? Because it seems that people only like to see bad things or to hear terrible news. Let us think about Africa: many bad things, many wars - as I said - but there are missionaries, priests, sisters who have spent their entire lives there, preaching the gospel, in poverty ... Last month when I went to Africa, I found nuns ... I remember one who was 83 years old, she was Italian, and she told me: I have been here since I was 26 years old. And there are so many holy families, many parents who teach their children well. Why do we never see families on television who teach well, who teach their children well? We don't ever see such things! Because we have an attraction for evil: it seems that we get more enjoyment from watching evil things than good things, great and beautiful things. The devil does his part - that's true - but also God is at work: there are many holy people! Not only in the missions, but throughout the world, in our workplaces, in families; many parents, many grandmothers and grandfathers who help those who are sick, who have problems; and this is never seen on television. Why? Because these things don't rate, they don't make good publicity ... Here in Italy, I have discovered many associations, men and women who give of their time to help, to accompany, to care for the sick. This is good. But this is never seen in advertisements. Is this true or not? If you want ratings - either in newspapers, or on television, or whatever - only tell about terrible things; people get bored with good things. Or else, perhaps they don't know how to present things well, to tell stories about good things well.
When you (speaking to the child who had asked the question) watch television, at home, remember these two things: there is a struggle in the world between good and evil, many children are suffering, there are wars, there are terrible things, because the struggle is between God and the devil; but also think about the many people, many holy people, many people who give their lives to help others, to pray for others. Why is it that we never see cloistered monks on television who spend their lives praying for everyone? This doesn't interest anyone ... Maybe they are more interested in the jewelry from an important firm, who wants to be seen ... things that lead to vanity. Let us not be fooled! In the world, there are terrible things, terrible, terrible, and this is the work of the devil against God; but there are holy things, holy things, great things which are the work of God. There are hidden saints. Don't forget this word: hidden saints, those who we don't see. Ok?
I want to thank you for all of this, but I want to hear another song before I tell you if I like how you sing or not ... And another thing: I want to hear you tell me again what Saint Augustine said about the Christian life. How should we live our lives? (they respond: Sing and walk!). Sing and walk! Second: who is good? (Only God is good)
Good. Now, I'm waiting for a beautiful song ... Thank you!
(the children sing a song)
Pope Francis
Now I can reply: you sing very well! Thank you!
I will give you my blessing, and also my greetings for the new year. And tomorrow, we will see each other in the Basilica, it will be a pleasure.
Let us pray to Our Lady, everyone in your own language.
Hail Mary ....
(Blessing)
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